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One more thing I would add, like a fourth thing, it's being able to learn something new, being able to humble yourself and to take on something different that maybe you haven't taken on before, and understanding that you can learn anything.

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Okay, Christian, did you see that anthropic expected labor impact from AI, where it was projecting like all sorts of these jobs, management, business, computer science, all almost like entirely at some point being able to be replaced by AI and any of the discourse around it? Yes, I have looked at what they came out with, and I've also been paying attention to

The real jobs reports that are given out. And I've been paying attention to a lot of anecdotes. So sometimes having worked in data myself, things can be hidden. And so you you always need to also be talking to the people that are actually being impacted. I started thinking about this reframe of how to look at that graph just the other day, where instead of like looking at that power control that they have of

large corporations saying what we can and can't do. The other way of looking at it is like all of those things that now need less labor, you can have access to yourself. So it makes doing and doing whatever you're passionate about and starting your own small business so much more feasible than ever before. Yeah, I'd say that's accurate. And

Where the conversation tends to go is is towards like yes, AI is replacing some jobs, but there's actually going to be all these other jobs that are created. But most of the time they're just talking about as these jobs at these bigger corporations, right? and where I think the conversation should should really be going towards is how can the individual and how can these small businesses actually have

basically more leverage. Like it these big corporations are having more leverage and they're saying, we can do more with less. We can we can lay off folks, but that means that the individual and these small businesses also have that ability. And it feels like kind of this great leveling, so to speak. Like it's leveling the playing field. And I'm not sure every individual business owner understands that, especially if somebody's maybe a little AI adverse.

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And then it's also how do you actually do it? And then what is that like economic impact of say we have a huge influx of small independent businesses? To me, the way I I when I when I view the world is I love small independent businesses and supporting them. So the more of them we can have, I feel like there is this great.

economic opportunity in having more. Like imagine if we have a world where there's, you know, 50, 50,000 new small businesses that open in the next year and each one of those hires five to ten people, all of a sudden you can start to see this shift in what the that labor market impact is going to be. Because if we have the same equal total number of jobs, but more diverse

openings, I think that's ultimately going to be a stronger economy. Yeah. And and you know, another piece of that is like I was w looking at a report the the other day about what is a high quality job and and where do those high quality jobs exist today. And I think the old era or the old way of doing things is these high quality jobs were really these these white collar and blue collar positions.

And now for like the first time in I don't know how long, there's actually been a flip of the high quality jobs are actually now considered the individual business owner. and at the same time, we're also seeing this this trend, whether it's just a hyped up word or not, of the solopreneur of somebody taking on and starting multiple different projects. And so I think we're seeing some distribution of I guess where energy and where things are are going right now.

And I do want to make a note, like we bring up the idea of fifty thousand businesses because that literally is an economy. and the more that we can help all of our local businesses and the more that we can do that, the more impact that it has not only on the individual, but also on our the community that we all live in. It's hard to like look at all of this and be I think what we've been talking about is like this excitement, this opportunity, right? Like

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This this casualty isn't, it's not all bad, it's it's this good. But it's also worth pointing out that it is also very hard to go through that change. And that comfort and that security that a lot of positions gave people was real. And I feel like there's there's so many different things that it gave gave you when you had that security in your job position, is not only was it financial security and safety.

But it was also an identity piece for you. So when somebody asks you, what do you do? You have an answer. I work in ma marketing for here. And what I'm expecting to see in this shift of as we need to start relying less and less on these big corporations, is we're gonna start seeing people going through this like identity struggle post-layoff or post-change in transition, where

We really have to start to trust ourselves that we're enough. Yeah. And I think you're you're bringing up a lot that that touches home. and I think the the one of the main areas that that makes me think about is actually this perceived sense of security. like like what's actually a part of security? is that access to your a p good place to sleep?

food, water, a community, having some of these basic needs met. and then it's also touching into I think pieces of who we are, who we think we are, and attaching maybe different ego pieces to like, I am this. And I think what's happening right now is that there's this it's maybe more of like a false sense of security.

And what I'm noticing in the field and talking with people who have gone through multiple layoffs because of AI is really the the fact that you can give so much of yourself, so much of your time, you can commit a lot to these big companies. And then when a macroeconomic shift happens, you're just toss you're just tossed out. Totally. Like it it's it's you aren't being treated.

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the way that you should be treated. And I and then that process of like re-engaging and re-trying to get I think in in these sorts of businesses, we try to quantify people so much, like on a piece of paper, like take a resume. But your value is much greater than what can be written on a one pager. and really that's what these corporations see when they are making decisions often is like,

Where are you at on the ladder? To me, it feels like they aren't looking at you as a person, but they're looking at you as an objective that they're trying to extract from you. and so you are it there's a sense of security, but at the same time, they don't have that same level of regard as a small business who might know you personally. The owner knows you personally and cares about you personally, cares about your well being.

wants to see you succeed, there's a difference in that exchange of like if you're if a small business is laying you off and letting you go, there is a heartfelt connection there typically, rather than this like mass layoff, we're laying off thousands of people right now today, and they're all getting the word right now and they have to figure it out. but a small business, that's personal. And I think that's a lot more natural and and humane.

And just normal way of for us to go about life.

Yeah, and I think you're touching on something really important because there's obviously the economic reason for for independent businesses, but there's also a community and relational reason on why independent businesses can actually make make us stronger as individuals, and they can help us form these longer-term relationships where there's a real vested interest.

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Question for you, Christian, as we talk about this, like this transition point, I would almost describe it as a ravine of change where you first have to go down and you have to sort of experience this moment of change in yourself. But at some point you start finding that that climb back up. And Christian, do you have any insight into what maybe have made things click to get from down here?

To go from up here? Are there any like signals that you sort of look out for and maybe have seen in others? You know, when I think about my my own experience, I really think about going deep on what what type of work feels fulfilling for me? Like what what can I wake up every day and

and feel just like naturally energized and good about what I'm bringing bringing into this world. and then another another piece that feels important to me is making consistent progress. Because sometimes as an entrepreneur and as somebody who has built many businesses is but if I'm not making progress, I can almost feel like

my gosh, what am I even doing? Or like, is this the right thing? I feel like there's this moment of like every entrepreneur where you're like always kind of questioning, is this the right thing? And so I think being able to tie it back to something that is more purposeful or something that's actually fulfilling is like a really great foundation. But then for me, there's also the momentum of like making each step.

and working. And then on top of that, I would say the third layer would be who am I doing the work with? Who am I collaborating with? Absolutely. I mean, I I experienced a lot of finding that recently is over this last year, I think I've tried to pick up so many different things, but a lot of the time things wouldn't click. And then when they were I almost want to say when they're out of alignment with what I should be doing right now.

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That next step of that consistency and step by step felt impossible for me to stick to. And that's something that I've found now with what we're doing here is it being more energized in what I'm trying to be doing. It's much easier to stick to that, that day-to-day rhythm that ultimately needs to happen, that consistency. And then that last part as well is that who are you doing that with? Is it needs to be people who

you feel energized to show up and work with day after day. Because if you don't, you're going to start resenting that work. And when you wake up, you aren't going to be energy energized to do it. I mean, one thing that I'm loving, when I'm doing work that's in alignment with what I'm trying to be doing, I don't want to stop doing it. I keep going until into the evenings because I'm enjoying the process. I'm enjoying the work. I want to keep working with the people. And that experience is something that I believe a lot

of people may not get in a lot of different settings. just because it's hard to find opportunities that are in that kind of alignment with you. But what is going to be in alignment with you is when it's your own thing or your passion that you're able to explore. And that's that's this key difference maker right now in this age is right now you have the tools to do whatever you want to do. You just have to go out and do it.

You have to find what's aligning with you and then stay consistent because it's aligning and find people to back that up is is what it's all about. Yeah. And if there's one more thing I would add, like a fourth thing, it's being able to learn something new. Being able to humble yourself and to take on something different that maybe you haven't taken on before.

And understanding that you can learn anything. And so for me, for example, on this project, like I had never touched Framer before, for instance. And all of a sudden I'm finding myself needing to upskill and needing to teach myself, like, okay, how do how do I become a very light, obviously not pro, like web web developer.

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and how do I take these courses and how do I actually learn? And how do I understand what's going into different aspects of of a site? I mean, that's how we grow as people. I always love this idea of like our comfort zones. And in order to grow and become more comfortable with more different things and become stronger, more diverse people, is we need to do new things to grow that space, to grow.

What feels secure and in our wheelhouse is we need to continue to push that limit. You can't go too far, otherwise things will get too crazy and you can't you won't get anything done. But if you're right on that edge of your comfort circle, that's where growth happens, both in what you're able to do, but also what you feel comfortable to then next try. And that's the exciting thing right now is anything you want to do or learn is it's easier than ever to pick up and start doing.

No, I agree. Was there's so Framer is one example. It's maybe not the best one, but but something is I've been I've been in product development for quite a few years. And what I find to be really exciting is the ability for me to to work with AI to support me and my subject matter expertise into giving me the power that maybe used to be like 20 people. literally like what I'm able to do.

And at first I wasn't really, I didn't really know how to do that. but I actually went and I researched and after researching, I found the different AI tools that I like to use and I actually self-taught. I was just like, okay, well, how do I do this? Okay, how do I connect to that? How do I actually do this and become productive? And it's that in that same vein of like always wanting to improve, always wanting to learn something new. Kind of reminds me of being like a little boy again, learning something brand new and just approaching it in that way around like

Okay, I'm learning now. Yep. And it's just you keep going and it's it's you you bring a lot to the table. It's not you're just having AI do it for you. You're learning throughout the process. And and it's not not your ideas or your, you know, I think there's one way of looking at a lot of these tools, and it's like you're not doing work. But

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You're actually you need to add all of the context to what you're trying to do. You need to be a visionary for what you want to create. That's still part of you. You know, I think there's this big debate of like if you use AI to do something, did you really do it? It's just making it more accessible. Yeah. And I think that's that's actually really important to to to like the conversation about like where are we headed with AI and what's it doing to us.

And so some of the topics that that brings up to me is like this ability that what's called cognitive offloading, where we're finding more and more that that people are asking AI things and then instead of making the decision themselves, they're basically letting AI make the choice. and I think a lot of that comes down to obviously the respon there's a lot of the responsibility matrix is is big on this. So I'm not going to claim it's any one place. But I think that for me as a builder,

How do I look at my own individual responsibility? And my own individual responsibility is to build my AI tools that people are going to be using in a way that has them what we're calling add the egg. So how can we be a great thought partner? But then how can we actually have AI programmed so that the individual, so the independent business owners ultimately making that decision on where they go? And how do we encourage that?

Because it's the person's vision. Exactly. It's the person's vision. It's their purpose. It's what they're building that's going to be important. And it's what your unique individual expression of that is what's going to make a successful business. is everyone see an AI slop? Everyone see what happens the other way already. And while the slop is increasing in quality, it's still slop. Absolutely. And you know.

I think a lot of folks right now may feel like they're behind because they aren't doing some of these things. But I think it's important to take a step back and remember like this is all very new. And it's also unmapped territory. So don't be like this moment of change, if you're feeling pain or transition, that's normal because we don't know what to expect. There's nothing comfortable about this experience that we're going through.

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But we're all paving this new way of doing things, doing business. And that's what we're here to do is we are also going through similar transitions, noticing s these changes in how we do things. And we are trying to apply them to us as just two people. And hopefully t other people can pick up things that we are doing and perspectives on that. And it can

Shed a little bit of light of how you can do what you want to do. And you don't need permission from a business to give you a job opening. If you have an idea, if you have a vision, you can turn it into something real. You have the tools. And that's what we're trying to do right now. Yeah, there's literally never been a better time to open up your own business, like ever. and I've been starting businesses since I was literally.

I think I was like 14, and I was selling dark ages of Camelot video game accounts. I was playing. and so yeah, there's never been a better time to to to start a business. All the tools are there, and that actually makes me, you know, Dylan, from your perspective, and so for those of you who don't know, Dylan created a coffee shop.

Here in our local town that has been very successful. it was very successful business, being a young entrepreneur. Like, how are you looking at all of this? is your perspective going to be very different than mine? There are different things that I'm looking at. And one is applications of AI, right? But also is my experience in how that opportunity came to be and how it kind of played out. And I want to

That was very much in alignment with what I was supposed to be doing at that time. And then we go through changes, transition, hit that over this last year, it's been in this deep ravine of unknowing, of people would ask me what I'm doing, and I stumble over my words because it's unclear. and so then once we've started getting the ball rolling here, it's like because it felt aligned with everything I was trying to do.

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it started to click and everything started to click, fall into place right one after another. But then how I'm looking at everything else we've talked about is I think about also the relation the importance of small businesses and that relationship with people that you employ. And every single one of the employees we've ever had, I've had a personal relationship with. And still to this day, I

see folks who we had the first summer when we opened, they'll stop by and it is so real. We're so excited to see each other because you build that personal relationship when you have a business at that scale. But then this other side of things is how am I looking at ways that we can automate or do things? Truth be told, a lot of what's going on in the cafe right now is being handled by amazing partners. I haven't

gone all out in terms of finding applications for it, but I've absolutely thought about it and thought about the monotonous tasks that are annoying and like, how could you set up your inventory system, set up a agent to you go and do your inventory, you plug it in, and then it links to all of your accounts and orders based on what you need that week. So your ordering's taken care of or your scheduling is taken care of because it knows

It sees the time off requests coming in. It knows it has all of the context of when people can work. And then it goes and posts a schedule for you. So there's so many of these things that take it off of your hands so that give you time back. So that either you can have that time to yourself and actually reap some of the benefits of owning a business. Or you can go and work on other shit that's probably more important than

some monotonous must do tasks and that's actually gonna help your business grow. Yeah, it makes me think about like you know, I got a good laugh when the NPC trend hit like a while back. in like watching people pretend to be NPCs. and I feel like when things come into like mimetics of like a a cultural shift, it's for a reason.

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And and I think what you're touching on right now is like we were all sold this vision of the American dream and work for these companies and doing these monotonous tasks was was a part of that. even so much so that in my opinion there was this convincing that women in dual dual income households was the only way.

and now we're seeing that really be upended. And we're all kind of sitting here and thinking, like, okay, well, what's next? And how do we actually work together to figure this out? And from in my opinion, it's going to be through supporting and growing independent businesses and giving people more of that that autonomy. Because the reality is, like, in the past, there well, okay, here, I'll I'll use a different terminology.

So there used to be this way of doing product development, which was called waterfall, which is basically like you're planning, you're planning, you're planning, and then it it waterfalls down. that didn't work because there needed to be a more agile system, which is how agile came out. So you can make changes in the middle and paraphrasing. Now with AI, it's almost like the way of working is actually leaning towards more like a modified waterfall.

Of where we're actually able to spend more time thinking about our vision, thinking about the future, thinking about what we want to see. And there's actually less time with the monotonous doing of the work. What I've been encouraging with our own work and where I see I feel like things are going is actually going to be less time working.

Which is actually going to be maybe a four day work week or where we're able to spend more time with our families. but in order to to get there, I feel like that's actually why you and I are sitting here today, because we're figuring it out with our business. We know other people are there figuring it out. And so how can we actually all kind of figure this out together? Yep. That's what that's what it's all about. And that's how we're all gonna sort of go through this point of transition and build this.

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new style, new way that we're doing things. And it's about doing it together. So I think we're just about out of time here, Christian. But do you have any other closing thoughts that you wanted to point out? Just anybody listening to this, like you can do it. Like you can absolutely do this. If you've never been a business owner before, like you can, trust me. You are capable, you can learn. There are the right tools out there that you can do this.

And if there's people out there who are already running a business and aren't really sure how to integrate AI, you also can do it. there's literally never been a better time to start your own business. I second that. All right, you guys. Well, thanks for listening. And yeah, this has been the second spring show. We'll catch you next time.